SUBMARINEMUSEUMS.ORG Forum
Individual Submarine Boards => USS Batfish (SS-310) => Topic started by: Jim on February 24, 2013, 10:57:58 PM
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Had a good chat with Rick and Mark S. at the Batfish today. Mostly talked logistics, project scope and priority. No pics today. There are many changes in the plan for the park and the museum proper, but the below will focus on the boat only.
The marching orders seem to be, 1). Dig out the stern. I believe and Mark/Rick concur that our current list and the rudder and stern planes being so far underground are putting "torque" on the stern of the boat. They are beginning to see a buckle in the upper deck and as weather and ground saturation change, it is affecting the boat. - Get out the shovels. 2). Repair/Replace the Port screw guard. It is bent and also torqued and is ripping part of the hull out with it. I could sure use a screw guard print from one of the other boats. ;) 3). Repair/Replace the deck supports and deck wood on the Bridge. Remove all of the brackets that are left and copy. There are still the lower brackets for the swing down port and starboard foot platforms and the port swing down seat bracket. These should be a start......More to come......DBF.
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What weekend do you want to dig, pressure wash, and paint the stern? I can send the word out, but it may end up being just the two of us. Mark A. used to send out the work weekend emails to a large group of recipients, but I no longer have any of those.
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Good question. I want to wait until after the Navy inspectors are through and see what they have to report to Rick that may change the priority lists. I ALSO want to have a better understanding of where the ships power is located. After talking with Rick, it exits the stern and possibly travels over the starboard stern plane!! If we start digging in there we will have to cut power to the boat at the pole first. I also need to know what kind of issues for insurance, personal liability if we get into the lines, where are going to put the excess dirt, how will we coffer the rear to keep the hill from sliding into the hole, etc. As close as the power line is to the dig, I may call in my F.I.L. He is is a lot better on the bucket with underground obstructions. I'll probably bring the tracked bobcat out as well to smooth and surface the area. It is alot less damaging to the turf.
There is going to be some expense in the rear wall (whatever that ends up looking like) and even if we do the work with free equipment, MWM is going to have to cover for materials. At the very least, I think it will have to be a concrete-footed paver stem wall with a gravel/french drain relief behind it. I would have to go shoot some transit elevations to see if it would need other reinforcement or not based on the downhill slope. Who did the work on the railroad-tie gangway-support replacement?
Do you have a pressure washer and is there a specific primer/paint that has been being used and does MWM have any more?
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Rick has the info on the contractor and the paint that we used on the rest of the lower hull - the rudder and planes will be black. He wasn't too thrilled with the contractor and some of the short-cuts that they made to the brick retaining wall and other areas.
I think the paint will be roll-on paint. All of the photos from the painting day in 2010 or 2011 (can't remember which year) showed people with rollers.
I do not have a pressure washer. Other work volunteers have them, but I'm not sure if we will see them any time soon. So, we might need MWM to shell out a little cash for a rental. We will need to bring about 50 yards worth of hose, too.
Understood on the dirt issues. It might help to limit how close we dig to the retaining wall that the gang plank attaches to. I believe that the tip of the stern is about 12 to 15 feet from the wall. The rudder and stern planes will be closer to 20 feet from the wall.
I'm wondering if we should dig down to the top of the planes by hand, first, with hand tools. We can at least locate the power cable and also see the condition of the planes. Then, we can use a backhoe to dig out the rudder and around the planes, with the final work probably being done by hand, again - i.e. getting dirt out from under the planes. Regardless of the current metal condition, we'll slap paint on her until we can do repairs.
EDIT:
I just realized that we'll have to dig from the tip of the stern to about where the hatch is for the ATR, because the prop shafts need to be completely liberated from dirt, as well. Maybe we can get mock-up props installed some day, but we'll just start with them coming out of the dirt.
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We need to see if Tom's Alabama crew can wip up another set of aluminum jobbies like the Drum has. ;)
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Then, maybe we can coat them with something to make them look more like brass.
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Afer looking at the last dry dock pictures on Torsk, I think that color would be a mix of greens.
Edit: an expensive french colour : Verdigris'
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Their brass has been sitting in brackish water. So, it's probably corroded.
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Mark, just looked at the stern lines print. We have to dig 10' down to clear the bottom of the rudder. :o Not a big deal to do in the sandy ground we have, but we ARE going to have a pond.
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Torsk no longer has her screws (propellers) her Starboard one is on display in Pennsylvania (IF I remember correctly) and the Port one was removed during the last drydock.. yes the bottom of the hull is black and if you go through the school of the boat or submarine discussion you will see that we actually discussed paint codes and I believe that Sherman Williams still makes some of the paint colors used.. Naval Jelly (rust inhibitor) works very very well in preserving your metal that is wasting away and yes it is expensive.. And if you look at the COD she hasn't had her screws in years :2funny: in more ways then one :2funny:
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Hey guys,
little thought here, i know in Virginia the utility companies did dig tickets for free, miss utilities was very good about coming out and marking ALL of the stuff in the ground so that it was not severed by an over zealous construction crew or home owner and we used the 5' rule when it came to digging with heavy equipment around power/water/sewer lines.. what that ment was hand digging a lot of dirt, however it kept us from spending a LOT of money to redo the utility lines.
Just food for thought and again my .02 worth
Darrin
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We can get the backhoe for almost nothing. Just the price of fuel to use it. Jim owns it.
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wish I was there to help Mark and Jim
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Thanks Darrin, our "screw" problem is a little different. ALL your boats are in the water and having no screws is hidden. Our lack of screws would be quite obvious. Right now you can't tell because we are almost full-rudder deep in the dirt, although I heard someone ask if they were under there this last "open house" day. You are also right about power markings. Here in Oklahoma its called - "Call Okie". The issue is they will only locate lines on right of ways and to the service. Our service is on the pole. The problem is the line from the pole to the boat.
I also appreciate the input on the digging. I worked as an inspector for a city and private civil engineer for several years and you wouldn't believe what people can do to underground services. I watched a guy plow a field right up to the road and sever a 500 pair line. :o He had to sell one of his kids. Another guy snagged a main line and got stuck. Didn't know what he snagged until he stepped off and grounded (without the tires insulating). Blew off an arm and a leg and killed him instantly. I have GREAT respect for underground power.
Come on down Darrin!! We have plenty of fun stuff to do! It's only time and gas money. .... ;D
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Darrin,
What is the diameter of the screws? When we dig the Bat's stern out, we'll probably need to make a wide, shallow basin under it to accommodate future screw replicas. Shallow walls would also reduce the need for reinforcing the basin's walls. We will probably just need a small retaining wall near the nearest pylon holding up the gangplank to the boat.
Speaking of gangplank, Jim, I wonder how much that will twist and bend if/when the boat goes to settle upright with the stern free. My idea is to dig out the planes, first and then the rudder, since the rudder is probably the main culprit keeping the boat listing. You don't want the boat to settle with the planes still underground. We're going to hear some creaking from the gang plank. Maybe we need to loosen the bolts holding it in place before freeing the boat.
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As we move forward with any project everyone has to remember that the museum has VERY little money. This is one reason that i need to keep in the loop on every thing. For digging out the dive planes I am all for this. I believe Jim is on the right track by building some type of coffer around the planes. Keep in mind the current paint job is a protective coat only. We did not sandblast or remove the old paint because of the costs involved in lead abatemnet. We do not want to go there. We have plenty of paint. There is $3000 available for this purpuse. That sould be more then enough to complete the equipment on the grounds as a whole.
I do have a drawing showing the lay of the electrical and water for the gounds and park. There is not a whole lot there so this should be easy. Also we will be taping into that line by summer for the lighting project.
I like the plan being disucssed so far. I agree with Mark S in that we probably need to dig the after plans out first then proceed with the ruder. We will need to use caution as we proceed as I am certain that the boat will be shifting as we do this. We will need to maintain the integraty of the gangway thoughout this project. The Muskogee Foundation just spent $40,000 to rebuild the gangway and the sidewalk leading up to it. An oops here would not be good. There are ways that we may be able to accomplish any further retaining walls for the stearage gear as we move forward. Start getting me some dollar figures. I can start working the issue.
Rick
PS I am looking at an Eagle project that will be repairing the back fence line. A bobcat would be very helpful in removing the old fence, trees, vines ect. :smitten:
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I'm wondering if we got one or two large pieces of equipment (say bull dozers) and attached a steel cable line from each of them to the large cleats on deck, maybe it would help the boat roll to port when we break her free. Then again, with the condition of the superstructure, we'd probably just rip a section of the deck off.
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If we take pressure off the stern it may right itself. The "kink" looks like she wants to go starboard but the stern is stuck to port. :-\
- Is there $$ to replace the back fence Rick? If you want to really replace it, we cut off the chainlink, roll it up, bring in the dozer and pull out the poles. If you advertise through the Muskogee paper or even free on Craigslist that the trees behind are fair game to anyone who comes through you, as long as they take ALL of the tree they cut, I think you will see those be gone too. Put a red "X" on the ones you want gone and get out of the way! Winter's not over and firewood costs money. 8)
- Mark, you may be on to something. The heavy brackets that they used to lift and secure the BAT to the barges are still on the hull. I had just mentioned to Rick that we should cut them off. MAYBE we give a little tug after the stern is free and see. I think that we will have to free the bow as well to get the full effect. The bow will be easier and take a smaller wall as it is (my estimate) only about 3-4 feet in.
- Why is there a lead issue? Drum blasted their hull in place didn't they? ???
- They spent $40k on that? I am in the wrong business. Rick, PLEASE, let me look at any further estimates that you get. I have over 25 years of contacts with companies all around Oklahoma. They took us (Batfish) to the cleaners on that. I could have used 1/2 that for industrial coffers both bow and stern. :'(