Author Topic: BATFISH 40mm Restoration Update  (Read 62862 times)

Offline MWALLEN

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Re: BATFISH 40mm Restoration Update
« Reply #105 on: August 24, 2008, 07:31:55 PM »
Thanks Rick.  We'll touch up the damaged paint on the 6th.  I'm going to call Vaughn and verify that he is coming on that day also and we'll get that taken care of.

Mark A.
"All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing" - Edmund Burke

Offline Mark Sarsfield

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Re: BATFISH 40mm Restoration Update
« Reply #106 on: August 25, 2008, 02:07:56 PM »
I know the frustration and feeling.  A few weeks ago I was working on the boat and someone handed me a knob which I later determined came from the radio room - they found it in the galley.  During our event weekend someone broke off a knob from the WCA stack and left it lying on the deck.  Roger Hudgins told me that he found it and didn't know where it came from.  Needless to say, the knob was damaged beyond repair and can't be reattached - the radio one can, thankfully.  Often times as I work arund the boat, I see bolts, nuts, screws, knobs, etc. laying around with no idea where it came from.  It's sad to see things get broken and discarded, but even worse when they do it on purpose.

I can see why some boats have put everything behind lexan.  It's a tough choice to keep it open for everyone knowing that someone's "angel" will be along to break it at some point.

Regards,
Mark Sarsfield
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Offline MWALLEN

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Re: BATFISH 40mm Restoration Update
« Reply #107 on: September 08, 2008, 11:56:15 PM »
touched up the paint.  Vaughn says he'll be down on the 20th to help with locking the 40mm down.

More then.

MWA
"All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing" - Edmund Burke

Offline MWALLEN

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Re: BATFISH 40mm Restoration Update
« Reply #108 on: September 26, 2008, 12:22:19 PM »
Vaughn stood me up...but will try to get him down on the 4th.

I noticed that a tourista had been playing with the 40 again as there was more scratches on the gun barrel.   :knuppel2:

Anyway...there is where we stand.
"All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing" - Edmund Burke

Offline Ctwilley

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Re: BATFISH 40mm Restoration Update
« Reply #109 on: September 26, 2008, 02:47:22 PM »
Before we install the lock mech. are we going to put the barrel guard on the railing? I haven't built the pole for the colors yet since the gun will beat it to death.

Offline MWALLEN

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Re: BATFISH 40mm Restoration Update
« Reply #110 on: September 26, 2008, 03:58:02 PM »
it should all be one piece.  I sent vaughn diagrams from the WW2 era photos telling him what I wanted.  He told me last time I talked to him that he had them and could easily make it and install it.

We'll see.
"All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing" - Edmund Burke

Offline JohnG

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Re: BATFISH 40mm Restoration Update
« Reply #111 on: September 26, 2008, 10:49:05 PM »
Why not put a guard on the rail so people could check it out? Mind you they aren't supposed to be up there but that something that would make it cool. I mean, how often does the average person get to learn how to use a 40mm cannon? I think something like that would be better than another, "Access Denied" spot. It's hands on. And hands on is something we need.
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Offline Ctwilley

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Re: BATFISH 40mm Restoration Update
« Reply #112 on: September 27, 2008, 12:53:18 AM »
So when he makes the barrel guard on the railing, he's just going to copy what was originally on the forward one and then put the locking mechanism on that. That's cool.

Offline MWALLEN

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Re: BATFISH 40mm Restoration Update
« Reply #113 on: September 27, 2008, 01:39:25 AM »
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So when he makes the barrel guard on the railing, he's just going to copy what was originally on the forward one and then put the locking mechanism on that. That's cool.

Yes, that is correct.  I mailed him photos of what the actual thing looked like...now I just need to get him out to make it.   :-[

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Why not put a guard on the rail so people could check it out? Mind you they aren't supposed to be up there but that something that would make it cool. I mean, how often does the average person get to learn how to use a 40mm cannon? I think something like that would be better than another, "Access Denied" spot. It's hands on. And hands on is something we need.

Not sure what you mean by "guard on the rail".  What I have in mind will be a replica of the real thing.  The barrel of the gun will rest in a locking ring.  Unfortunately, we can't allow "hands on" to everything.  I've already posted what happens when touristas help themselves...what took my wife and me most of the summer to restore was damaged probably in one afternoon "learning how to use the 40 mm".   Now, if Rick wants to let it out...that's his call.  I would hope it's under supervision by him, a volunteer or a re-enactor to ensure it doesn't get damaged...plus to answer questions.  I think the 40mm doesn't qualify for "hands on".
"All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing" - Edmund Burke

Offline JohnG

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Re: BATFISH 40mm Restoration Update
« Reply #114 on: September 27, 2008, 03:10:46 AM »
By putting a guard on the rail I mean something that will keep it from scratching the paint off. As of right now there is nothing at the museum that is hands on. Yes you get to go through the sub but it's still a look and move display. Things that make the Tulsa Air and Space Museum or Omniplex great is the fact you get to touch, move, play, manipulate things. Not just a bunch of static displays. One could argue that it's for staff and re-enactors only, but they won't hardly ever use it and if so for what? The gun doesn't do anything but move. Me and Travis played on it one day and loved it. Do we play on it all the time. No. But for that one time it was great and for normal people that one time is what counts.


Plus, whats the point in having the gun restored to a working order if your just going to lock it down?

I have worked there 2 summers and the one thing that kids to adults always did was the Morse code in the radio shack. Sure every once in a while something messes up but all in all it's just routine maintenance. The gun gets scratched, it sucks, but it's no different then a knob missing on the Morse Code, someone gets a touch up brush and coats the area super fast. We have to remember this boat (and gun) survived World War 2 and 60+ years. Letting people have a once in a life time chance is not going to do irreparable damage. And as long as we keep a eye on it nothing bad will happen.
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Offline MWALLEN

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Re: BATFISH 40mm Restoration Update
« Reply #115 on: September 27, 2008, 10:10:30 AM »
John - I really don't want to get into a debate about this.  Let me answer your questions.

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Plus, whats the point in having the gun restored to a working order if your just going to lock it down?

The point is to have it like it looked during the war (as much as possible).  I'm all for leaving it unlocked, but until your can trust people to use it and NOT damage it, then it gets locked down.  And as soon as I can get Vaughn out, it will be.

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Sure every once in a while something messes up but all in all it's just routine maintenance.

Restoring the gun wasn't routine maintenance.  It was a lot of work by my wife and myself, and mostly by Vaughn and he built the support and the flooring and then got the gun up there.

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The gun gets scratched, it sucks, but it's no different then a knob missing on the Morse Code, someone gets a touch up brush and coats the area super fast.

So, can I count on you to come out EVERY day to make sure it has paint on it from people working the gun?  The last two times I was out I have had to repaint it.  It works down to metal and then rust starts.  I'm involved w/ the deck now and would rather not have to paint the barrel and railing EVERY time I come out.

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We have to remember this boat (and gun) survived World War 2 and 60+ years.  Letting people have a once in a life time chance is not going to do irreparable damage. 

No, what we have to remember is that the submarine is a MUSEUM and people and volunteers need to treat it as such.  If we are going to restore stuff just so some person can have a "once in a lifetime experience" and then damage it...then I'm all for locking it down.  Why should one person get to damage it for all others?

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And as long as we keep a eye on it nothing bad will happen.

Well, I'm open on how to do that?  Rick can't sit out there all day.  Can you?  No, bascially it's me keeping an eye on it when I'm out every other weekend.

I don't want to be a stick in the mud here, I do want people to come and enjoy their visit.  However I don't want work that is done by anyone to be ruined because of some person wanting to get their "experience".  The problem is that only my wife, me and Vaughn put anytime into restoring this...so no one else seems to think it's a problem to go play on it.

Mark A.
"All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing" - Edmund Burke

Offline Darrin

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Re: BATFISH 40mm Restoration Update
« Reply #116 on: September 27, 2008, 11:06:47 AM »
Well Mark A. you have hit the delimma of ALL of the museums around the world regardless if they are submarines or aviation.....  Now that you have a project complete and you want to make sure that it looks pristine for many years to come you hate to see what happens when they scrape the barrel of the 40mm against the railing again damaging all of the hard work that you have done. You have a number of choices one of which is my least favorite is the chain and pad lock to make sure that the visitors don't operate your equipment that you worked so hard to restore or there is the making the area off limits.... again making all of the hard work that you and those involved was for near nothing because it will be nothing more then a static piece of equipment and at that point it didn't warrant having a full restoration of the 40mm OR you have a welder come out with some blanking material to make sure that the tourists are able to move the gun up and down, right and left but NOT being able to hit the railing, so that means that they would have to weld a stopper on the elevation gear to keep it from going all of the way down.. 99.9% of today's tourist's will never know that that wasn't origional and that will give them the once in a lifetime experiance of moving that 40mm and every time you see that 40 move you can say with a smile on your face that YOU restored that to working once more.
Just my .02 worth

Darrin

Offline MWALLEN

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Re: BATFISH 40mm Restoration Update
« Reply #117 on: September 27, 2008, 11:13:21 AM »
Quote
have to weld a stopper on the elevation gear to keep it from going all of the way down..

That may be the option for us.  Yes, I am on the fence on this one.  I want to let people operate it, like John pointed out...and he is correct...it is a great experience and I don't want to deny someone of that. But again like you said...how to minimize damage.

The locking ring was just an idea since boats had them anyway.  Welding a stop on the elevation gear teeth might work.  As long as we can keep them off the railing, then I think we'll be OK. 

Thanks for the insight and comments.
"All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing" - Edmund Burke

Offline Darrin

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Re: BATFISH 40mm Restoration Update
« Reply #118 on: September 27, 2008, 12:20:24 PM »
One of the hardest things that I have done is gone to the museum's who have plexiglassed over EVERYTHING or made everything off limits, we are the protectors and biggest supporters of these museums and we make them live once more not only for us but for those whom are interested in it and for me it is to show the children of today what happened a few years ago and then they can hopefully bring their childeren down when it comes that time.

With Torsk it has been a labor of love to bring a empty steel tube back to life once more, granted when I got to her the TVA had been there for 5+ years and done so much and now ALL of the hard work by countless men and women is starting to come together (and not all of them have ever served a day in the military).. The biggest thing that I can say about Torsk is that she FEEL's like she is a working boat and not a static museum boat (overly sanitary and painted) we are rough on the inside and outside but she works more now then she has in 30+years and the more people that vol the better that she looks and feels.. In the last 4+ years that I have been onboard I have seen HUGE changes in her and the attitude of the crew.

Remember one thing with a good crew you can do anything, the sky is the limit on what you can do with your boat.. No matter how bad she looks on the inside and outside a determined crew can do maricles. KEEP YOUR CHIN up no matter what, you are giving your time to make sure the children of tomorrow can see what those of us did in the past.

To me the folks from the USS Slater and the LST 325 have lived that motto, as have other submarine crews (Cavalla and Torsk) all of these crews have done the near impossible to bring the once discarded ready for scrap vessels back to life once more and in the case of LST 325 she is once more back at sea doing what ALL of us wish we could do once more.... give a the public from many different states an inside look at what our fathers and grandfathers used to work on and live on.

You folks on the Batfish have my deepest respect for saving her before it is too late, keep up the good job... One day ALL of the boats will give the Pamp and the Bowfin and the COD a run for their money.. And to me IF we can give them a run for their money it will be bittersweet because we had not a whole lot of outside help and it was the VOLUNTEERS who made it all happen.

Offline JTheotonio

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Re: BATFISH 40mm Restoration Update
« Reply #119 on: September 27, 2008, 02:49:12 PM »
Is there a way to wrap the railing with some sort of padding during open hours that would protect the 40mm yet let people play with in?
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