SUBMARINEMUSEUMS.ORG Forum
Individual Submarine Boards => USS Batfish (SS-310) => Topic started by: MWALLEN on April 20, 2008, 08:43:40 AM
-
Just wondering if other museums suffer from any type of vandalism?
We had put up doors (wood frame w/ plexiglass windows) in the officers area as we have put out items (plates, books, magazines, etc...) to give it that "lived in" look. Before the doors, things would come up missing.
Well apparently last week, some of the doors have been forcibly (sp?) removed from the bolts on top holding them to the wall and from the bolts holding them from the floor...and again items have been removed.
Was wondering what other boats do to prevent this. This is a source of frustration as spent many days making those doors...and several of us have spent our own money purchasing these items...only to have some low-life theif destroy and take these items.
I'm going to talk to Vaughn next time about making some iron-type doors by maybe welding some rebar and figuring a better way to secure these doors to prevent this in the future.
Thanks for your input.
Mark A.
-
>:(
We need to make some more fake cameras like what is in the control room with a flashing LED run by a battery. When they see the cameras, they'll think twice about stealing in the future.
An additional idea is to buy those cheap alarms that you can stick/screw to a door frame and door. As soon as the door is ajar, a high-pitch alarm sounds - like 120 dB. Even a violent vibration will temporarily set it off. The noise alone should cause them to depart the sub quickly... or at least that area. They'll think twice about looting another part of the sub, too.
This is something to keep in mind when the reenactors are aboard, also. If they leave out uniform items and other militaria, it will end up taking a walk during tours - espically if we're all topside scraping paint and laying wood. I think this is one reason why Correy is asking the reenactors to bring a small brass lock with them. I'm not worried about a jacket or a large wool blanket. Pins, hats, photgraphs, magazines, etc. are easy to hide, though.
This may be a local cultural thing, too. Batfish has been looted since she was brought up the river. It's almost like a rite of passage or coming of age. Kids think it's cool if they're one of the people that got away with stealing from the suibmarine. If they hear their dads, uncles, friends, etc. telling their stories of thievery, they'll want to do it, too.
-
I do not want to take away any of the seriousness of this issue. Vandalism and theft is a big risk that we take when we open the sub to the public. I do want to say that this is the 1st time that I have had any problems with theft and vandalism since I arrived.
The idealistic side of me would like to say that everyone that comes to the park are genuinely interest in learning about the park and the and military history as a whole. However the realisting side is that 0.5% of the people that we have come to the grounds do not respect the issue. I have a very good Idea as to who did this vadalism. I also am taking actions to correct the situation.
For the reinactors: You need to realize that this is a public facility and people do come through. Though the occurances are rare you need to be aware of the potential danger people going through thing. People have sticky fingers and a natural curiosity. I have sat and watched pople try and open doors and cabinets to look inside (usually kids) with authority figures in plan view (ie park staff and parrents). Kids are especially bad at thsi. and most of the will argue after the fact.
For the restoration crew: The door designs are very good. I thnk a little redesign of the orriginal door will work. Reinventing the wheel is not a good idea. We need to replace the latches on the bottom of the doors. they seem to be a little under developed for our purposes. Also the top bolds on the goats locker were pulled out of the wood. Find some way to strenghthing that point. I am also going to move the master key to a more secure location. I do not want to annouce that location on the internet for security reasons.
I worked with a sherifs office for 4 years before coming out ot OK. I have seen people do some strange things. The biggest thing I learned is that any lock can be broken and any security systme can be bypased. It is only through the constant evolution of our own security system that we can keep ahead of the vandals/thieves.
Keep up the good fight and remember what we are here for.
-
That really sucks. I was in hopes we could eventually do away with the doors, but I guess not. We should definately put up some more fake cameras though. We should check with the other museums, to see how they have secured their officer's area, because from what i have seen many of them also have plastic up so people can not get into the rooms.
-
For the restoration crew: The door designs are very good. I thnk a little redesign of the orriginal door will work. Reinventing the wheel is not a good idea. We need to replace the latches on the bottom of the doors. they seem to be a little under developed for our purposes. Also the top bolds on the goats locker were pulled out of the wood. Find some way to strenghthing that point. I am also going to move the master key to a more secure location. I do not want to annouce that location on the internet for security reasons.
I thought that when I put these us that the locks at the bottom of the door would be enough to deter people. I guess next time down, if it hasn't been addressed by then, I'll re-evalute the design and try to figure something else out.
-
Travis,
Most of the other museums have paid tour guides. We do not have that luxury. Maybe a few years down this is a possiblity, but we need more income first..
-
Mark A
I thnk some beafier locks at the bottom will help. and secure the hooks at the top better.
-
On the Drum we use metal Pipe (1/2') or 1" angle iron and lexan glass held with srews and nuts or tamper proof screws. On the screw on covers we have had to pop rivet them in place. I had a patrol chart stolen out of the plotter in the conning tower and it was fastened down with straps and screws. I see kids and adults trying to force locks and lockers and valves and anything else they think might move, they steal the lenses from the Christmas tree and any colored lense on an electrical cabinet that is lighted. We are giving up on our plan to light gages and cabinets, it just isn't worth the hassle.
I hate to say it but the biggest problem is the scouts. Most of them carry those handy little pliers with screw driver blades and when you have 250 of the little twerps running thru the boat unsuppervised they are going to take it apart. We only have one guard on duty on the weekend for the whole park and I take some time off occasionally so you can imajine what it is like. Good luck.
Tom Bowser
-
Travis,
Most of the other museums have paid tour guides. We do not have that luxury. Maybe a few years down this is a possiblity, but we need more income first..
I know most of them only allow guided tours in order to keep things there, but some still have doors up to prevent people from getting in there, I know the Drum has plastic barriers up (saw them in Lance's photos.
-
True, One of my favorite comments that I do get back is that we are the most open boat in the museum fleet. I see a decision point comming up. How secure do we need to keep our museum? do we totally block things off or do we allow people to touch and feel. It is my experience that interactive museums do far better then the static museums. There has to be a balance thought. Maybe a preservation plan is in order here....
-
We are trying to leave some things open and let them play with things that are extremely hard to break or if it does break it will just cease to function and will not detract from the history of the boat. We only put out copies of photos etc and even those are behind glass. I really envy the boats with their verical ladders, limited number of visitors and that are closed most of the year and then have guided tours only. With the amount of traffic we have and only closing one day a year and the limited number of employees and only one volunteer it is difficult.
Tom Bowser
-
True, One of my favorite comments that I do get back is that we are the most open boat in the museum fleet. I see a decision point comming up. How secure do we need to keep our museum? do we totally block things off or do we allow people to touch and feel. It is my experience that interactive museums do far better then the static museums. There has to be a balance thought. Maybe a preservation plan is in order here....
I think the ways things are now is fine, we just need to make our present things stronger, so they can not be tampered with. things such as the doors in the officer's area.
-
Give the battery operated alarms a try, too. They can be mounted out of view, but will make ears bleed when molested. (We'll need to wear "mickey mouse ears" when we go to open one of the doors, until the alarm can be deactivated).
Tom, that's a shame to hear about lenses going missing and a warning to us in the future if and when we start to light panels up, again. The 1MC will be easy to protect with some chicken wire over the controls. It seems to work well with the light switches.
-
....and I take some time off occasionally so you can imajine what it is like. Good luck.
Tom Bowser
Tom is a liar! He NEVER takes time off! :2funny:
Seriously, stealing from the sub was what struck me the most when I visited the Drum back in October last year. I absolutely could not believe that anyone would steal things that could not be replaced. I mean, we were all kids once, but even back then I don't think I could steal from a museum! And with the advent of collectors and eBay today, you never know what someone's intentions are these days.
-
We are especially alert for people from other museum boats- just kidding. The big problem is the parents and scout leaders do not try to educate their brats that these are museums and historic vessels and of course the kids and parents don't take time to read, if they can. They think it is just a movie set. Opp's I guess it is, I will have to quit using that phrase.
I do take time off, I haven't had to use my GPS to find my trailer in about a month now, hey maybe my memory is getting better.
Tom
-
BZ Tom... If I had not already gotten ride of my wife, I would have loster 12 months ago....
We are discussing warning plaquards are the Batfish for future potential litigation. This may be something that needs to be addes to our warnings. I really hate puting this kind of signage uup as it detracts from the natural beuty that we have at our park not to mention the sub. Too bad people do not use that welt of flesh God put on their sholders.
-
Rick
We have signs up in the forward torpedo room as they come in the boat asking not to twist or operate and about stealing and fines, they just don't read them or care and as far as I know the park has never charge any scouts even when caught red handed.
I am thinking about tying in recordings to some of the stuff that if it moved or operated ,a loud voice would come on saying" Leave me alone do not touch" and possibly a general alarm go off.. but then they would go back and operate it just to hear it
The park does not want the employess getting on the scouts or leaders about their behavior either. When I know we have a bad group of scouts I will go in early on Sat and Sun morning and chase them off the boat. We just have too many scouts and not enough employees or volunteers.
Tom Bowser
-
:)
I'm guilty, heck I tried to move a switch in the maneuvering room with Tom standing over my shoulder! hehe Most things are bolted in place so that they won't get worn out from moving them around though. I can imagine the feeling of trying to move a switch and it break off in your hand....oh no.
-
Here atain I think we are all guilty to some degree. Not only do I take care of the sub, I am a den leader for the local cub scouts and father of 3 . The little rug rats can be terrible. Even while visiting the Razorback my kids started taking off on me. This can be a major bummer as I am trying to learn as much as I can while wrangling 3 little monsters that can get by on looks. It all goes back to that natural curriosity thing...
What really bothers me it the ones that do not admit it. I understand breaking something. It happens. Just admit it when it happens.
Still love the kids though.
-
You can always employ Dogbert's Day Care tactics Just duct tape them up and contain them in a compartment... for a fee.
-
Vandalism reparis are well under way. I should have them completed by the end of the week.
Rick
-
Hey Rick, what exactly happened? Or are we not at liberty to discuss on the forum?
-
I really do not want to talk about it on the foum. fortunately the damage was not bad. No grafitti or anything like that. just some minor damage to the security mesures in the Officers country....
-
Sorry to hear that. I don't know what this world is coming to. People in general seem to have no fears or respect for anything anymore.
:tickedoff:
-
I was out to the boat on Thu April 17th for the 1st time in a long time. thats when I went aboard the boat & noticed all the Vandalism.The first thing I noticed was the wooden doors had the locks on bottom floor broken off.I didn't expressly look for missing items. I'll do so soon. I spoke to Rick about the "Boat sure needed some love & care" before I realized it was vandalism,thinking it was a work in progress. I'm working every day now except Sunday & thats Church twice so I don't get out on that day.
I was out to the boat again on Saturday April 26th (without going aboard the boat) & talked to Rick about how good a job he is doing on the display cases with his new arranging of items, before I read this board about vandalism today the 28th of April & made my comments.
Sam the radio guy
-
Hey Sam...good to see you here. And yes, it's been a while since I've seen you. I understand about schedules though.
Don't be a stranger!!
Mark A.
-
I was out to the boat on Thu April 17th for the 1st time in a long time. thats when I went aboard the boat & noticed all the Vandalism.The first thing I noticed was the wooden doors had the locks on bottom floor broken off.I didn't expressly look for missing items. I'll do so soon. I spoke to Rick about the "Boat sure needed some love & care" before I realized it was vandalism,thinking it was a work in progress. I'm working every day now except Sunday & thats Church twice so I don't get out on that day.
I was out to the boat again on Saturday April 26th (without going aboard the boat) & talked to Rick about how good a job he is doing on the display cases with his new arranging of items, before I read this board about vandalism today the 28th of April & made my comments.
Sam the radio guy
By the way, welcome to the forum Sam!
-
I agree, I am glad you are getting on as well.
Sorry Lance Another BF guy. We are taking over...... ;D
-
We are taking over
I wish other boats were as active...we could learn alot from each other
-
Here are some basic and LOUD door alarms that we might want to consider for some of the doors on the Batfish:
http://www.radioshack.com/product/index.jsp?productId=2844467
http://www.radioshack.com/product/index.jsp?productId=2850623
http://www.homedepot.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/ProductDisplay?storeId=10051&langId=-1&catalogId=10053&productId=100081817
If you leave the hatch open from the control room to the main deck (above the dummy), you'll probably be able to hear it, if you're outside of the main museum building. Some have the option of setting a delay or going off instantly.
Here are some more of those dummy cameras, too. You just have to change the batteries every so often for the blinking LED:
http://www.radioshack.com/product/index.jsp?productId=2049770
http://www.radioshack.com/product/index.jsp?productId=2509409
-
We are taking over
I wish other boats were as active...we could learn alot from each other
At the same time Mark, I think its clear from the activity and the passion of you Batfishers here that many others can learn much from you.
-
We're kind of paving the way/blazing a trail. We'll have so many projects on here, it will turn into a do-it-yourself fleet boat repair site.
-
No one has posted an update on here in a while and I wanted to mention the newest fix to the vandalism problem. Volunteers have created new doors for the Fwd Battery area. They are square stock with mesh grate on the bottom and a small lock at the top. They still have plexi windows over half the height but it's MUCH better than what was originally in there. They are also lightweight and easy to remove for living history programming.
-
One of the radio club members fabricated and installed the doors. They are definitely better at taking day-to-day abuse!